Nobu Sato

Choose your boss, not the company

People leave bosses, so spend the last five minutes on your next one

Contents4
  1. Why the boss
  2. Turn the interview around
  3. Outside the interview
  4. When the boss changes after you join

When you change jobs in Japan, the boss matters more than the company. Look at why people use resignation proxy services, the firms you pay to quit for you. The top reasons are fear of the boss and having no way to raise things themselves. Persol found 28.8% citing fear of the boss. In en Japan's survey, six in ten users said they wouldn't have used the service if the boss had been easy to talk to. The numbers are in the resignation-proxy post.

Everyone in recruiting knows that people leave bosses, not companies. Yet almost nobody uses the interview to size up their future boss.

Why the boss

In the exit-survey post I described the four-layer model. Exit questionnaires reach the outer two layers, but people actually leave because of the inner two, or because of the boss. The boss sits in the context layer, and context is a big lever. The same person under a different boss can perform three times better, or three times worse.

The company is a brand. The boss is where you spend eight hours a day. The brand goes on your resume. The boss goes into your mood, every day.

Turn the interview around

In Japanese interviews, the candidate gets to ask questions in the last five minutes. Use them on the boss. You can read about the company anywhere.

I'd ask three questions. Each one asks about something that happened. None asks for an opinion.

First: "The last time someone left this team, what was the reason?" Listen to how they talk about the person who left. If they put it all on that person, or take it all on themselves, both are warning signs.

Second: "The last time you and a direct report disagreed, how was it decided?" You want to know whether a report has ever talked them out of a position. If it has never happened, it won't happen to you.

Third: "If I join, what's the one thing you most want me to get done in the first three months?" If there's no concrete answer, they haven't thought about what you're for, and once you're in you'll drift.

People leave bosses, not companies, so spend the last five minutes on what your next boss has done

Three questions for your next boss in the last five minutes of the interview. Ask about events, not opinions. Background figures: Persol Research and en Japan surveys on resignation proxies

“The last time someone left this team, what was the reason?”
How they talk about someone who left
They put it all on that person, or take it all on themselves
“The last time you and a direct report disagreed, how was it decided?”
Whether a report has ever talked them out of a position
It has never happened
“What's the one thing you most want me to get done in the first three months?”
Whether they have thought about what you're for
No concrete answer. Once you're in, you drift

Six in ten resignation proxy users say they would not have used one if their boss had been easier to talk to. Spend the five minutes on the boss, not the company.

Figure 1. People leave bosses, as the 28.8% of resignation proxy users who cite fear of their boss show, so in the last five minutes of an interview ask your next boss about three events: why the last person left, how a disagreement with a report was decided and what you should get done in three months.

Outside the interview

The boss you meet in the interview is the best version of that boss. If you can, spend ten minutes with someone who has worked under them. In Japan the chains of acquaintance are short, and through a recruiter or a mutual contact you can usually find one. You only need one question: "What are they like under pressure?"

Patterns under pressure only show up under pressure. That's how I assess candidates, and it's why interviewers ask about failure. Bosses are no different.

When the boss changes after you join

This happens a lot. Run the three questions again, this time by watching day to day instead of asking. If you still can't see the answers after six months, treat it as a new interview.

At startups and small companies the boss is usually the founder, and this needs adjusting. I'm also less sure it applies to people whose strongest driver is autonomy. They tend to care less about the boss in the first place.

Think back to your last interview. In those five minutes, what did you ask your future boss?

How to check the answer to that third question once you've joined is in your first 90 days in Japan.

What to do when the boss changes after you join is in when your boss changes: the first 90 days are an interview.

Writing about launching in Japan, in three languages.